No More Learning

Pearce: the Michigan professor Donald Pearce co-edited with Herbert Schneidau Pound/Theobald
(1984).
Kemal: Mustafa Kemal Atatu ? rk (1881-1938), founder of the modern Turkish Republic.
143 EP to Wang (TL-1)
Will be
Deelighted to see Hnbl/Wang
whenever he gets here. Finale to VISIT, as from
of His Excellency etc.
quite lively/
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] 11 Ap [1956]
see no way of shortening unless you omit the Wrst ''forever'' and show pause by spacing
sic: He shall live forever.
by no means sure this is any improvement.
Hnbl/Wang gives me credit for knowing a great deal more than I do re/ Chinese.
Know only Fenollosa's notes, and the Classic Anthology and have probably forgotten all I learned from F[enollosa]/ during past 40 years.
can only impart by example and by a few remarks in my criticism ABC etc.
178 from poetry to politics
beware dictionary equivalents/ weight etc/ 2000 years diVerent emotional tone/ relation to social or unsocial order.
? ? may be it was a night-club ? ?
144 Wang to EP (ALS-2; Beinecke)
Apt. 9, 242 Mulberry n. y. 12, n. y. October 8, 1956
Caro maestro [Dear master],
Chao called me about a week ago concerning the plan which you and he had
discussed. After listening to what he intended to do, I suggested that we should perhaps start a journal in English to facilitate the exchange of Chinese and American thoughts. It should cover Chinese literature, art, music, economics, medicine, cooking, etc. The expenses of such a publication should be kept at the minimum. Chao and myself will try to enlist patrons to support the publication-- with your help. We will also get responsible and capable contributors to write about the topics in which they excel. What think you of this suggestion?
Yesterday I called upon the two young ladies from Texas. They are charming and patrician, as compared with the typical New York product of Brooklyn, Staten Island, etc. Miss Marcella Spann had the good fortune of attending a school where an intelligent instructor was given the freedom to teach what he considered to be the best instead of the ''great books'' recommended and prescribed by the college authorities. I read the reading list of her Comparative Literature course. It was a challenging but not overwhelming list. Among the authors included there were Shakespeare, Voltaire, Confucius, Pound, Joyce, Eliot and Wyndham Lewis. There were no Feodor ''Idiot'' Dostoevski, no Thomas ''Magic Button'' Mann, no Joseph ''Jungle Jim'' Conrad, and above all, no John ''Archangel'' Milton. I always pray for the day that there will be another ? ? ? (the Wrst emperor of Ch'in Dynasty bc 221-210) who burnt all the reference books and literary ''masterpieces'' that had cluttered up the libraries and buried alive in mud all the ancient and doddering scholars. My cry is let there be another ?
?
? !
For eugenics' sake, please tell me what the best books on money issue are.
I plea to translate the complete poetical works of ? ? [Wang Wei] of ? ? (Tai Yu ? an, Shensi), T'ang Dynasty poet and one of my ancestors. ? ? is generally known as WANG WEI in English, but I think it should be spelt as WANG FEI or WANG FAY. Which name sounds better to you in English?
May I visit you again within three weeks?
? from poetry to politics 179
Kindest regards to Mrs Pound-- [signed] ?
P. S. Enclosed a new poem. Please suggest possible improvements!
Marcella Spann: see Glossary on Spann, Marcella.
Dostoevski: Fyodor Dostoyevsky (1821-81), The Idiot (1868-9). Mann: Thomas Mann (1875-1955), The Magic Mountain (1924). Conrad: Joseph Conrad (1857-1924), Lord Jim (1900).
WANG WEI: see Glossary on Wang Wei.
145 EP to Wang (TL-2)
Note the most eYcient method used by E. P. for putting over authors: Joyce, Eliot, W. Lewis.
This was not done by starting NEW mags/ but by entering and strengthening mags/ already there and which had printers and mild distribution etc.
Ergo, for consideration C[hao] & W[ang]. NOTE that an excellent venzuelan Francisco Rivera (no relation of Primo)
is at 2604 Fulton Av. Berkeley, Calif.
he invites, what he cant have, contribution from E. P. for a new magazine, strictly literary.
starting with St J. Pearse, which is excellent in so far as it is respectable, non- committal, guaranteed to keep OFF and away from all vital issues sticking to culture.
I suggest yu send him yr/poem, / say that a group of Han [Chinese]/ could greatly strengthen their mag/
(opinion of competent, if anonymous critic)
You cannot put over chinese interests save a CULTURE at this moment.
It is no TIME to start anything by plunging into the abyss of Chinese politics
as of 1956.
Ergo, say you have been ASKED to inquire if the mag/which Rivera recom-
mends would devote 8 pages monthly to the best chinese tradition.
You can call his attention to the Chinese World for 1 Oct. Confucius' birthday
issue.
Say that some chinese scholars cannot aYliate with the Ch. World at this time. But that they could presumably come to focus on a scholarly or poetic review
of autochthonous nature.
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] 11 Oc [1956]
? 180 from poetry to politics
Rivera has not given name of mag/ nor of poetry edtr. It should at least provide outlet for C. and W.
not committing them to inconvenient or impolitic views as to immediate events.
Alzo/ the gt/ tradition comes via the written word. There are millions of $ ready to yatter about art/ Metropolitan museum Hsu ? an-tsung etc.
Whatever you are able to do in 20 years time/ a START/ with 8 pages or even 4, at no expense to C & W. can be solidly made IF Rivera can swing it: i. e. a section under advisement of C & W.
Chao even moving forward as from Chiang [Kai-shek] and the Ch[inese]. World. without going into opposition, always with due respect to respectable elders Chao endorsing what is good in Chiang, W[ang]. observing the virtues of
Chao that he happens to approve, and restraining himself temporarily re/ points of diVerence.
Gli uomini vivono in poshi [Men live in small groups]. IF three eVective issue [s] of X. appear it cd/ be drawn to the attention of [Achilles] Fang and [Joseph] Rock.
one can only procede BY INDIVIDUALS. name, cognomen and address (when the hell-hounds aren't on the trail of the protagonists)
I shd/ more relish NAMES than general subjects, such as cooking (needing speciWc demonstration and certainly dealt with in the restaurant ads/ in Ch/ World, not to say their sumptuous representation of pantomime)
Hawley can be considered AFTER you see whether Rivera can be useful. which i request you do AT once by airmail.
yes, of course glad to see you in 3 weeks, one week, or whenever you can raise
the car fare/ no need of special permission etc. on regular days, Sat/Sun/Tu/Th/ no one likely to be here whom you shd/avoid.
I shall be interested in prompt reports on progress/i. e. toward a LIST of
speciWc individuals who can write in a way to cause readers to READ re/ the Celestial tradition.
Many Wnd Fang unreadable. Others are bloody well bored at hearing about the dullest european philosophers, or having chinese light correlated to euro- pean obfuscation etc. Cooking is to EAT. economics are likely to be KILLED, I mean any ref/ to them shd/ be made AFTER the seed of kulch has at least sprouted an inch or two.
benedictions.
Rivera: in his reply of 22 October 1956 Francisco Rivera states that he ''is NOT directly connected with any literary magazine'' (Beinecke).
Chinese World: in 1958 David Wang became a reporter and translator of the San Francisco bilingual newspaper.
Hsu ? an-tsung: Tang emperor Xuanzong or Tang monk Xuanzang. Rock: see Glossary on Rock, Joseph F.
Rivera's letter: see Letter 145 n. Kasper: see Glossary on Kasper, John.
from poetry to politics 181
146 Wang to EP (ALS-1; Beinecke)
c/o Dartmouth Club 37 E. 39th St. n. y. 16, n. y. Dec. 5, 1956
Enclosed you will Wnd a copy of Rivera's letter. I am not sure if he is mad or he is only mad at you.
I have been prevented from coming to see you mainly because of an urgent matter which developed in my apartment. My present roommate, a Jew of Polish descent, has rummaged my collection of nationalist literature. And, I believe, he has come across such lines as
''Decadence sets in
When kikes and niggers
Became overseers,'' in my writing.
I tolerated him up to very recently because I needed someone to share my
rent after Bob Sharp, my former roommate, had left for his truck-driving job and because he asked to stay on after he had sublet my apartment during the summer. Now I have to keep an eye on him until he is out of this place. I asked him to move out yesterday, and he begged to stay on till the 1st of January.
I don't understand why Kasper does not devote more energy to uprooting the polluting elements in the United States.
I may have to use force to evict this nasty little Jew, Karler (Korowitz). I wonder if I can get some help in this respect.
Sempre [as ever], Hsin
147 EP to Wang (TL-2)
For a little serious conversation re/points not covered during Wang's visit. O. K. eugenics/ very necessary /
endocrinology not kikietry.
spot distractions /
WHIB. Wheat in bread party.
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] [January 1957]
182 from poetry to politics
a concept the incult should agree on/
and comprehensible at all levels.
Unfortunate that J. K[asper]. shd/ be on local line, not on universal slogan / What they get diverted FROM is issue of money.
& tax SYSTEM.
both of which need INTELLIGENCE on the part of anyone who is generating
resistance.
ergo there are items for aristos.
all the mutt can object to is the AMOUNT of the taxes.
NO publicity will be given these issues by the Meyerblatt and similar sewers. AND very few people either understand or are LIKELY to understand them. the secret doctrine is necessarily secret NOT from desire to monopolize it. Does R[alph]. R[eid]. yet understand ANYthing about history?
his ethic seems O. K.
Has Wang himself digested the Sq $ series?
A magazine shd/ be organ of something.
hence q. proper to want a manifesto.
let me see draft of it as soon as posbl/
WHEN possible avoid american tendency to split/
cannot admit corruption/ that we agree on.
BUT should not exclude useful parts of a mechanism
such as production facilities.
keep eye out for paper-MANUfacturer /
only material component
i. e. human component in material process who has NO interest in worse
letters <rather> than in better.
from econ/ angle
He alone WANTS more printed matter to be in course of becoming without regard to its being monotonous
to him 100 books selling 1000 each are as good as one book that sells 100 thousand. he don't OBJECT to someone he don't understand doing something good.
i. e. QUA paper manufacturer.
Basic principle autarchy and local control of local aVairs unfortunately
weakened by issue that cannot be universally accepted.
WHICH is universal to any sane human being. it eliminates Miltons and Ikes.
J. K. : see Glossary on Kasper, John.
Meyerblatt: Eugene Isaac Meyer (1875-1959), American banker and owner of Washington Post and
Washington Times-Herald.
R. R. : Ralph Reid, a regular visitor, contributed ''Opus 1, no. 1'' and ''excerpts from F. L. Wright'' to
Edge, 5 and 7.
Ikes: in an undated letter to EP, Wang writes: ''I had never dumped Dulles with Eisenhower:
I consider him to be one of the few Conservatives left in Ike's regime of 'modern Republicanism' '' (Beinecke).
Ouang-iu-p'uh
from poetry to politics 183
148 EP to Wang (TL-1)
Baller, 1892 and 2nd/ edn. 1907 printed Wang iu p'uh's ?
?
?
comment on, or expansion of, the Sacred Edict, but does not give translation of Iong Cheng's [Yongzheng's] text.
It would be advisable for Hsin to make THE authoritative translation, BOTH because I shd/ like it, and because Stock cd/ print it, AND because it cd/ be useful in disciplining bullyumaire Xoundstions etc.
VERY hard to distinguish lyric poets suYciently to discipline publishers (even when the latter are better than crablice).
16 pages, a convenient length.
Three respectable Emperors / wd/ be useful to get 'em back on the map and the respected W[ang]. iu-p'uh was a credit to the ? [Wang] family
re/ Hsin's question of a week or so ago / more expensive to maintain twins
AND a putative father, than to maintain twins alone.
this may not be the comfort the unfortunate are asking for.
? ? ? : Shanxi Salt Commissioner Wang Youpu's colloquial expansion of Kangxi's ''Edict'' is included in F. W. Baller, ed. , Sacred Edict. Cf. Canto 98/708:
?
?
On the edict of K'ang-hsi
in volgar' eloquio taking the sense down to the people.
149 EP to Wang (TLS-2)
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] 18 Feb [1957]
some Yong Ching [Yongzheng] very damnbiguous/
Salt commissioner [Wang Youpu] much needed. also Wang now. interesting see where come out Hsin view
also some very Gemisto
Ez view.
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] [February 1957]
184 from poetry to politics
or if not damnbiguous, various inclusions possible but salt commission was needed.
Wang poems Edg 3. O. K.
Hsin's zillusions re/ celerity of postal service that takes 3 days to get letter from Cong. Heights to Wash/D. C. oYce comes ON Monday to ask about permit fer ManGawd to git on on the Sunday preceding.
If you dont turn up THIS sunday / will send a few IDEAS, fer yu to try on London Soc. Crediters etccyroar.
I dont spose YOU have copy of TIME fer 9th inst. which no one here has seen or procured?
news of its copying Tempo mendacity arrives from Orstraliar.
ZO Sd P. S.
Yong Ching
I think him
write
?
? ?
Canto 61?
W. L[ewis]. for long time/ lot undigested wrong reading matter in gullet / NOT by any means / ? or ? [gentlemanly]
mind active, not stop in same mess
but lot mess ergo cf/ Hroobloody/hrussian [Russian]
Sacred Edict/ bilingual for Wang's comment
Chinese only for Iong Ching [Yongzheng]
2nd edtn Shanghai 1907/ Presbyterian Mission.
Baller trans/ the Wang
Gemisto: the Byzantine philosopher George Gemistus Plethon (c. 1355-1452) is listed in Canto 98. Wang poems: ''Tang & Sung Poems,'' Edge, 3 (February 1957).
:EP's seal with which he signed letters. It has his Chinese name ? ? ? (Bao En-de; Preserve Grace-virtue).
Canto 61 ? ? : Yongzheng ? ? (r. 1723-35) of Canto 61.
? or ? : Phrase taken from Yongzheng's expansion of Kanxi's ''Sacred Edict'' in Baller. Cf. Canto 98/711:
''Parents naturally hope their sons will be gentlemen. '' ? cheng
? king
150 EP to Wang (TLS-1)
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] 26 Feb [1957]
Dear Wang
I dont understand the reference to Duke, N. C. Certainly did not express
disapproval as know nothing about the place.
? ? ? from poetry to politics 185
There are a couple of other N. C. institutions crawling with liberaloid egg- heads, pinko-commisants etc.
What might be more use is recent commendation of Wang by Dr W. C. Williams,
9 Ridge Rd. Rutherford,
who is far more unlimited in expressions of approval than E. P. ever is,
tribute all the better in being spontaneous, and I dont think W. C. W. knows that I know you. He had seen yr/ poems in print.
Perhaps he could be used to sway the commanders. [signed] E. P.
Williams: in a letter of February 1957 William Carlos Williams (1883-1963) told his college pal EP: ''I do enjoy EDGE--the last translations from the chink by/of David Rafael Wang are worth the trip half way round the world to have encountered'' (Beinecke). For Wang's collaboration with Williams, see ''The Cassia Tree,'' New Directions, 19 (1966); rpt. in Collected Poems of William Carlos Williams, vol. ii, ed. Christopher MacGowan (New York: New Directions, 1988). The EP/ Williams relation is chronicled in Pound/Williams: Selected Letters of Ezra Pound and William Carlos Williams, ed. Hugh Witemeyer (New York: New Directions, 1996).
151 EP to Wang (TLS-1; Beinecke)
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] [February/March 1957]
Dear Hsin
The foregoing for use on idiots or others.
IF I were recommending anywhere in particular I wd/ tell you to apply to
what I think is called Washington U. east shore Maryland, in reach of the nashnz's keppertl.
There is at least one literate there, and he says the faculty is not lousy, which is mostly the case in murkn beaneries.
You might drop an enquiry to Tom Jones
113 Maple Av
Chestertown, Md.
He is interested in Corneille / in disagreement with Monsieur Reid I believe/ but that doesn't in least imply that he wd/ agree with Hsin.
BUT, damn it, a human being, literate, on ANY campus is a reason for at least
enquiring into local facilities.
Why THE hell don't anyone go see D. D. Paige <141 E. 44th St. >, who does
know something about N. C. tho I dont think he was at Duke.
Hold on/ I think it is the U. N. C. that stincgks. At any rate dont know anyone
there/ ask PAIGE.
186 from poetry to politics
As to Pindaric urge . . . it led Pin to rhetoric, or @ least that was my impression. [signed] Z
Washington U. : in spring 1958 Wang enrolled at the University of Maryland.
Tom Jones: in a letter to EP of 1 November 1956, Tom Jones introduces himself as ''president of the Mount Vernon Literary Society of Washington College, in Chestertown, Maryland'' (Beinecke).
Reid: Ralph Reid. See Letter 147 n. D. D. Paige: see Letter 28 n.
152 Wang to EP (TLS-2; Beinecke)
14 Marzo [March 1957]
IMPORTANT clariWcation:
Hsin has no Pindaric urge--at least what E. P. calls the Pindaric urge. Hsin, not being a genius, realizes his own limitations.
As Hsin sees it,
the greatest Narrative poems have been written by Homer, Chaucer, and Po
Chu-Yi;
the greatest love poems by Propertius, Catullus, and Ovid;
the greatest Imagiste poems by Li Po and Wang Wei;
the greatest Religious poems by Yeats and, perhaps, Blake;
the greatest poems on Ethics and Morality by Dante;
the greatest Dramatic poems by Shakespeare;
and the greatest Political poems by E. P. and Tu Fu/
What is actually left for Hsin to write but a subject in which he can excel others? The point is that no one has written anything DECENT about sports except
Homer (in snatches). And if you try to write artistically about the speed, the color, and the sound and fury of boxing, you'll Wnd it more diYcult than writing about the ethos of Confucius. HAN and T'ANG dynasties emphasized sports besides the arts. MING and CH'ING dynasties relegated athletics to an inferior position. The Greeks were aware of the importance of exercise. But the modern Chinese have neglected it. The consequence: the Chinese became eVeminate weaklings bullied by the West. The great Chinese novels, The One Hundred and Eight Bandits (or Water Margin) ? ? , and The Dream of the Red Chamber ? ? ? illustrate two diVerent concepts of the CHINESE HERO. In the former the men are real Chinese, i. e. virile and lusty; in the latter the hero is a Proustian type degenerate a la France. Before the Yuan Dynasty the artists were also men; after the Sung Dynasty the poets and painters were intellectual molly-coddles, as found mostly in France and the United States today.
(Incidentally, these two novels are better than anything [Henry] James has written. )
[New York]
? ? ? ? ? ? from poetry to politics 187
E. P. is a great tennis player, per esempio [for example]. If E. P. were an eVemi- nate, he would not have written Personae and The Cantos. AND you know what Kung thought of the athletic Tze-Lou and Julius Caesar of the athletic Antony.
[signed] ?
Po Chu-Yi: see Glossary on Bo Juyi.
? ? : a masterpiece of Wction about 108 outlaws (c. 1370) attributed to Shi Naian (c. 1296-c. 1372). See
Outlaws of the Marshes, trans. Sydney Shapiro (1980).
? ? ? : a masterpiece of Wction depicting the decline of a powerful family and the tragedy of two
young lovers (1754) by Cao Xueqin (c. 1715-c. 1763). See A Dream of Red Chambers, trans. Yang Hsien-yi and Gladys Yang (1978).
153 EP to Wang (TLS-1; Beinecke)
[St Elizabeths Hospital] [Washington, DC] 21 Mar [1957]
HSIN/
wot is the min chih party / it's [its] badge not in ideogram /
people's WHAT party, there being 5000 chihs.
I take it Ching mei, is the keppertal of the ex-republic of the U. S. and a
Washington delegate of the elegant plum bank might be of a district, or of WHAT?
The lady wot sez <she wuz> Idaho and mormon, dont appear malevolent, but the paper DEcidedly unsegregated.
whether useful <place wherein> to suggest that Ez is against certain diseases of thought that have aZicked various races / there being a lot of non-semitic jews, etc.
I don't know
You probably know by now that the gal [Anne Lebeck] is (or is said to be 26 of age) etc.
she thanks me fer prospect of printing you/ but you have not been expan- siVO on the ambience or chances/
Got to be kept separate from the distinctive quality of Edge/
the min chih has a red badge but it dont look hroosian red/ said to have scared old Mr whazzisname. bolshies in Mathews dic/ have other labels/ not min chih old Lampmen kusses Bill W[illia]ms/ BUT you realize that for 50 years there have been almost NO amerians writing to say what they think, 99. 9999%
writing to try to get past a copy desk.
hence the value of Bill W.
Mrs Ponsot refers to the ''copy cathedral'' her blurb says ''so far they have 5 children. ''
Ouan soui [Cheers] [signed] Z
? ? 188 from poetry to politics
min chih party. . . Ching mei . . . lady: see Letter 155.